AGRR™ magazine/glassBYTEs.com™ Message Forum

AGRR Magazine
AGRR™ Magazine

glassBYTEs.com

AGRSS

NWRA

Key Media & Research
Privacy Policy


ATTENTIONThe glassBYTEs.com forum is being retooled and will return with a new look and functionality that will hopefully help our readers even more. Watch for an announcement when it will be ready, it will be a few months.

You can still stay up on daily news and comment on stories by signing up for the glassBYTEs daily e-newsletter at glass.com/subcenter. There is no charge. Hope to see you there!
General Forum
This Forum is Locked
1 2
Author
Comment
BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

I suggest that each of you who owns your own glass shop prepare obscenely low Benchmark Prices of Insurance Premiums for your vehicle insurance premiums, building insurance premiums, liability insurance premiums, workman’s comp insurance premiums, health care insurance premiums, and the premiums of any other insurance you carry and submit these Benchmark Prices to your existing and prospective insurance carriers for your next fiscal year telling them what you will allow them to charge you as a percentage of the Benchmark Price.

Then instruct those who are willing to accept your pricing for their insurance products to submit their bills to one of their competitors whom you designate to be your Third Party Administrator who will consider the bills for payment.

If you think this is ridiculous, think again, because they believe it is a terrific idea when they do it to you.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

My own man, I read your posts here all the time and you hit home hard. But you are wasting your time trying to get the sheep in this industry to stop being sheep. That is why the insurance companies thru their puppet Nags and TPAs exploit them and will continue to forever.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

I have witnessed the sheep moan and groan about NAGS for decades. They find it easier to do that than take charge of their businesses.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

My vehicles are insured with State Farm. I think I'll have State Farm send my bill to Allstate for adjustment and payment.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

My neighbor made me swear that I wouldn't tell a soul that he saw my wife coming out of a hotel room with some strange man.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

They say the same thing about my wife every time we leave the room!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

MY OWN MAN , VERY WELL PUT !!!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Larry,


I am sorry you find me strange!!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

GEICO wanted to bid on being my insurance carrier but I told them they were not on my list of approved prospective vendors because they were unwilling to accept the discount off my BENCHMARK INSURANCE PREMIUM LIST which I was offering, and since they wouldn't accept, they were therefore disqualified.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

My existing insurance company wants to know how I came up the my premium benchmark prices. I said I won't tell because it's PROPRIETARY. Hahahahah!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Hey my own man, I started to put my list together and am wrestling with my BENCHMARK PRICE for what I will allow insurance companies to charge me for comprehensive fire, theft and collision. I suspect I know how the Nags proprietary formula works so I think I may try it and throw low numbers in a hat and pull them out one at a time.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Keep the thread moving as everyone can see this glass business

and the way it is controlled by tpa's and insurance companies

is quite the scam. It will take real effort to change this model

but we are working on it as we speak.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Glassbytes posted an article 4/26: NAGS Benchmark: Further Details Revealed

It discusses NAGS tweaking this or including that or updating this and that etc etc etc

I really have to laugh. I DON'T CARE WHAT THEY DO OR DON'T DO. THEY ARE NOT PART OF MY LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

For the umptieth time---- NAGS and TPA's do not exist for me. I create my selling prices the way every retailer in any business should in the manner I have discussed in previous posts and no insurance company has ever shown my price to be unreasonable and for years they have known they dare not short pay me.

I ain't no rocket scientist folks but I have made an exceptionally good living in this business and you could too if you took charge of your own affairs and stopped letting outsiders dictate to you.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

A guy went thru a stop sign and plowed into me broadside last month. The police came and the guy who was clearly at fault got ticketed.

I had the car towed to my friend's body shop and called the guy's insurance company Allstate. They said "You are our customer and we are going to take care of this! Have the car sent over to xyz body shop and we will fix it for you."

I said, "Your customer is the negligent idiot who crashed into me. I am your adversary and will become your worst nightmare if you don't pay my friend xxx for restoring the car to my satisfaction. Cars don't bleed and your patronizing attitude only encourages whiplash!"

"There will be no problem from us, sir."

Car was fixed and the bill was paid in full. These clowns are accustomed to working through intimidation or smarmy artificial "helpfulness." 99.999% of people are sheep and kow-tow to them and they are not accustomed to people standing up to them.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

I'm reading these posts and starting to think nags isn't infallible and more important, not necessary for billing. I had thunk they were! Isn't it written in the U.S. Constitution that thou shalt pay homage to and obey nags? Or was that one of the ten commandments? I always confused easily and I'm not too bright, I guess that's why I followed nags and the offer and accepts all these years and sent my bills to my vilest competitor TPA for adjudication and possible payment if they would condescend to accept my billing. Duh. Gutta go now to watch the Kardashians and try to keep up with 'em.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

When Safelite starts quoting insurance companies a percentage off nags instead of a flat averaged price and begins buying their glass as a percentage off nags, then I'll start to use nags in my shop. And when Safelite starts sending its bills to Gerber for payment instead of directly to the insurance companies, then I'll start going thru TPAs.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Since this thread started, I've been waiting for some little loony tune to post a new topic about what the nags benchmark is for a such and such because she bought one from the dealer and has to make sure her bill is acceptable when she mails it to SL to present to the customer's insurance company. Haven't seen one in several days. Are the loony tunes too embarrassed these last few days?

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

dennis
When Safelite starts quoting insurance companies a percentage off nags instead of a flat averaged price and begins buying their glass as a percentage off nags, then I'll start to use nags in my shop. And when Safelite starts sending its bills to Gerber for payment instead of directly to the insurance companies, then I'll start going thru TPAs.


Well said!!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

I don't see any posts here from the Nags and TPA loyal worshipers defending the status quo. Could it be because there is no sensible defense? Or is it their only thing to just complain about Nags and the TPA's and hope and pray that their Lord Nags is going to raise the benchmarks out of kindness to them and then all will be right with the world. It's pretty sickening.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

I would like to find out how to bill without with out using nags.

Part #'s, do we use Dealer part #'s only? Add my hourly that

makes me a fair and reasonable profit? Add mobile and disposal fee's

and send to insurance companies direct for payment with a assignment on

our invoice?

We are new in the business and do not want to have any affiliation to a 3rd

party network as this would be counter productive to our business model.

Thanks for your reply's

Kind Regards

Biggie

Small

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Biggie Small AG
I would like to find out how to bill without with out using nags.

Part #'s, do we use Dealer part #'s only? Add my hourly that

makes me a fair and reasonable profit? Add mobile and disposal fee's

and send to insurance companies direct for payment with a assignment on

our invoice?

We are new in the business and do not want to have any affiliation to a 3rd

party network as this would be counter productive to our business model.

Thanks for your reply's

Kind Regards

Biggie

Small




No one is objecting to the NAGS part numbers. They are the only thing of value from NAGS. "counter productive to our business model"? You sound like an insurance company troll or a NAGS troll.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

You have to bill the actual part number that you install! You have the right to mark up what you paid and to charge a reasonable labor rate.

In my opinion, Insurers have abused their positions as holders of the purse strings and users of biased and complicit TPA's to unduly influence what they try to establish as prevailing rates.

Simply because many shops have been coerced into accepting offers so as not to be "bad mouthed" by the insurers or their TPA's, does not mean that said offer automatically constitutes a "prevailing" rate.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

I'm just a one man operation. A local small fleet operator called and asked what I wanted to replace a particular windshield and when I told him, he said another one man operation was $45 dollars cheaper. I told him he better go to that other guy because I do a professional job and won't work that cheap. He said the other guy is away on vacation. I told him when I'm away on vacation, my price is $90 cheaper!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

An American Family agent told me I'd probably get more work if my prices were lower. I told him he'd probably sell more policies if his premiums were lower.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Why on this site do people like yourself automatically assume you are a

Troll for the Insurance company,TPA or Nag's when trying to get helpful

information to help fight the billing practices that insurance companies

and TPA want to shove up your A..

If everyone would help each other then you would probably have more

independents also billing direct and using a billing model that makes

a real profit and not waiting for the BONE with no meat on it

that a TPA wants to throw at you.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Biggie Small AG
Why on this site do people like yourself automatically assume you are a

Troll for the Insurance company,TPA or Nag's when trying to get helpful

information to help fight the billing practices that insurance companies

and TPA want to shove up your A..

If everyone would help each other then you would probably have more

independents also billing direct and using a billing model that makes

a real profit and not waiting for the BONE with no meat on it

that a TPA wants to throw at you.




GO BACK AND READ VARIOUS PIECES WRITTEN OVER THE MONTHS ABOUT TAKING YOUR GLASS COST AND MARKING IT UP TO INCLUDE OVERHEAD ETC OR GO TAKE A COURSE IN BUSINESS. THE LESSON BEING TAUGHT HERE IS THAT ONLY FOOLS ALLOW A PARTS NUMBER PUBLISHER TO DICTATE WHAT THEY CHARGE AND ONLY FOOLS SEND THEIR BILLS TO THEIR COMPETITORS FOR PAYMENT AND ONLY FOOLS ALLOW INSURANCE COMPANIES TO TELL THEM WHAT THEIR TIME AND MATERIAL ARE WORTH AND HOW MUCH PROFIT THEY ARE ALLOWED TO MAKE.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

A lot of good questions here. Who died and made NAGS, TPA's, networks, and insurance companies gods?

Over the years I've read here NAGS ought to do this, NAGS needs to do that, NAGS needs to explain why, NAGS should tweak this, NAGS is below what I paid, and so forth and so on. Only lately I'm reading: Why should anyone CARE what NAGS does or doesn't do? Maybe the mindset that elected President Trump is waking up in the auto glass business and a revolution that like people wanted to take charge of their government, maybe we now want to take charge of our industry.

The job of the insurance company is to make their customer whole again after an incident-- not dictate to the people who make them whole how much they MUST accept as payment rather than what is RIGHT AND PROPER in a free market, free enterprise capitalist society.

As far as the TPA's, somebody wrote here the other day Safelite should send its bills to Gerber for adjudication and payment instead of to the insurance companies.

Isn't the absurdity of the ridiculous status quo starting to resonate?

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

This string makes a lot of sense.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Consider how NAGS, insurance companies, networks, and TPA's are concerned about the well being of you and your business and then give them the due and deference that they deserve. And start acting like a business person instead of a chattel peon.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

I don't see the sheep weighing in on this.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Maybe the IGA could do something constructive for once and offer help in teaching small operators-- and bigger ones too-- how to mark up their costs to profitable levels and submit their bills directly to insurance companies for payment and to stand hard on getting paid in full.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Lou in Mass
Maybe the IGA could do something constructive for once and offer help in teaching small operators-- and bigger ones too-- how to mark up their costs to profitable levels and submit their bills directly to insurance companies for payment and to stand hard on getting paid in full.


Lou has a good idea!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Lou in Mass
Maybe the IGA could do something constructive for once and offer help in teaching small operators-- and bigger ones too-- how to mark up their costs to profitable levels and submit their bills directly to insurance companies for payment and to stand hard on getting paid in full.


Why would any shop need the IGA for help with that? If a shop owner is that helpless, he/she should close up the shop.

IGA & NWRA should work to expose the collusion between insurers and TPA's.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Daveycrewcut
Lou in Mass
Maybe the IGA could do something constructive for once and offer help in teaching small operators-- and bigger ones too-- how to mark up their costs to profitable levels and submit their bills directly to insurance companies for payment and to stand hard on getting paid in full.


Why would any shop need the IGA for help with that? If a shop owner is that helpless, he/she should close up the shop.

IGA & NWRA should work to expose the collusion between insurers and TPA's.



To Daveycrewcut: you are skirting the crux of the whole problem--- #1 The shop owners ARE HELPLESS which is why they let themselves be led by the nose by NAGS pricing and should indeed close their doors if that is all they know about charging for their services #2- If you ignore TPA's and bill direct, then who TPA's are or aren't in collusion with would be of no issue for you

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Getting the iga to do something constructive like what is suggested here ain't never going happen anymore then people here standing up against the ones who crap on them. Only thing the people who read this stuff and post here are famous for is *****ing and bellyaching about tpas and insurance companys and nags and networks that cut there throats. Same old same old.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Bill Direct, Get policy language from all insurance companies you do business

to understand what they cover and then hold them to it.

Not one that I have seen mentions having to use a TPA/Competitor to get paid.

Also never a mention of having to use a nags formula that does not make

the slightest of sense to bill with.

Have a good Atty. to help and bill what you are worth.................

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

I dutifully follow nags and I know next time they will raise the prices real high so I can enjoy a better standard of living. Now if you will excuse me, I have to go and water my unicorn and feed my dragon before I put on my wings for my daily flight to never-never land.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Why doesn't Gary Hart from IGA put 2 cents into this conversation? Especially with helping people create INDEPENDENT operating models that don't DEPEND on outsiders directing how they live and breathe ?

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

First of all Gary Hart has not made a appearance on this site for over a year

now.

The IGA does nothing but collect money from the sheep that are willing

to donate for ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

All independents need to do is save your Money find a good atty. and

like I said in a previous statement get a copy of a policy for each and

every insurer and break down the language and hold them to it.

1.IS there one insurer who mentions Nags in their policy???

2.Is there one insurer who mentions using a TPA in their policy???

can you see where I am going with this???


Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

dennis
When Safelite starts quoting insurance companies a percentage off nags instead of a flat averaged price and begins buying their glass as a percentage off nags, then I'll start to use nags in my shop. And when Safelite starts sending its bills to Gerber for payment instead of directly to the insurance companies, then I'll start going thru TPAs.



This point from Dennis woke me up. I'm going to talk to my lawyer about getting out of a couple of things I shouldnt of signed on to like some network prices. I only get these jobs they don't want or couldn't handle out near me and I would of got them myself anyhow but if I stay on I want more money or wont do it.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

The insurance companies are busy, busy, busy people. The are busy collecting premiums and busy investing their staggering profits. But they do find a little time to run cute television ads and run golf outings. But you expect them to receive claims, check prices, and process them before paying out? ARE YOU INSANE? They are way too freaking busy collecting money and it is so much cheaper to use TPA’s who tout the lowball benchmarks concocted by a publisher who serves only the insurance companies’ interests and who keep the suckers in line with the concoction.

I would like to see a representative from NAGS weigh in on this forum as to what benefit the auto glass industry derives from them besides a handy parts numbering system. Their PROPRIETARY mumbo jumbo does WHAT for anyone except the TPA’s and insurance companies and their own NAGS bottom line? Tell us please, NAGS rep, why your benchmarks are better for us auto glass retailers than us creating our own prices which either sink or swim in a free market American competitive environment like every other **** business and industry!!

And NAGS, if your answer should include the word CONVENIENCE (and for us installation companies too?), then I say to my fellow colleagues here: continue to enjoy that CONVENIENCE as you keep BENDING OVER to receive the just rewards which NAGS convenience brings you.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Uh, yes. Exactly who are nags benchmarks helping beside insurance co.s and nags and tpas?

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Always Dreaming

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Yes, hell of a question!
Uh, yes. Exactly who are nags benchmarks helping beside insurance co.s and nags and tpas?


I also would love to hear NAGS tell us how their benchmarks help US and not just insurance cos. and tpas and themselves. US ! I'm all ears!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

There's a Korean tailor shop in the strip mall across from my shop. I went in to have some pants shortened and looked at his alterations price list. It was dated 2009. He's really a nice old guy and I suggested maybe he really ought to raise some of his prices to keep up things. He said he might if he gets some free time.

Hey NAGS--- there is a great opportunity for you- benchmark alteration prices! Hahahaha!

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

NAGS's quick answer here to what the benchmark does for us installers as aposed to the insurance co looks like the kid who pointed to the king and said he was naked.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Our Atty. is breaking down all the policies word for word and also

dissecting the whole Nags pricing method.

Guys and Girls this is a costly procedure and we will find out exactly

what is LAW.

We have found several questionable items within the policy language and nags.

We will keep you posted as to what is happening.

If anyone would like to financially help with the project we will have a

link to share soon.

And to the Web host here, we are not asking to ban together and Sue someone

we are just asking for help with getting to the bottom of what is

the Law.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Law and Order
Our Atty. is breaking down all the policies word for word and also

dissecting the whole Nags pricing method.

Guys and Girls this is a costly procedure and we will find out exactly

what is LAW.

We have found several questionable items within the policy language and nags.

We will keep you posted as to what is happening.

If anyone would like to financially help with the project we will have a

link to share soon.

And to the Web host here, we are not asking to ban together and Sue someone

we are just asking for help with getting to the bottom of what is

the Law.



Law and Order-- I see a major division in what you are looking at. The fact that insurance policies say nothing about Nags and insurance companies have no legitimate right to have shops follow Nags is the most important thing. Then the hows and whys of Nags pricing method becomes irrelevant. If I simply create my own pricing NOW, which is what I NOW do, every aspect of Nags and their doings and not doings is of no freaking concern. With all do respect, Law and Order, as I see it, you are just knocking yourself out and spending money to reinvent the wheel.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Not true benji. The 1963 consent decree bans auto insurers from doing ANYTHING that might have the effect of steering a consumer to or from a service provider.
So how can an insurer make a legitimate offer through a DRP program to a service provider that it isn't supposed to refer (steer) customers?

Auto insurers are not supposed to do ANYTHING that has the effect of controlling pricing, yet they collude with TPA's to do just that. Unlike health insurance policies that incorporate penalties for going to out of network service providers, auto insurance policies must be issued knowing that the insureds have the right to choose any service provider, yet the insurers try to limit the insureds choice by incorporating verbiage that is prejudicial to the insured who chooses an out of network service provider. The case must be made in court that those "limits of liability" are violations of established public policy and must be ruled unenforceable!

Simply because one service provider has agreed to do certain work for a discount does not mean that another service provider who charges more is unreasonable in so doing.

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

Interesting. An April 18 post by Country on the topic "Unionize Now" jumped higher on the forum board than more recent ones about this topic. Are the TPA's and NAGS trying to downplay and squelch this discussion by putting heat on Glassbytes?

Re: BENCHMARK PRICES OF INSURANCE PREMIUMS

This string is now fading into oblivion and the passive sheep shall remain in obedient servitude.

Wisely NAGS has never weighed in here to tell the multitude what it does for it as opposed to what it does for their brethren insurance companies. For yea, it does nothing but perpetuate the misery the multitude deserves for being spineless.

Does the choir of the multitude sing out, “We shall bill insurance companies off NAGS when Safelite bills insurance companies off NAGS!” ? No, they doeth not.

SOON THE BABBLING HERE WILL ONCE AGAIN RETURN TO:

NAGS needs to explain to us how they come up with their prices!---- rather than: who cares, I don’t use their prices.

There needs to be an investigation to look into NAGS being in cahoots with the insurance companies!---- rather than: who cares, I don’t use their prices.

Did you see the new NAGS? Popular parts went down by x% and others went up by y% and the overall weighted effect is only z%!---- rather than: who cares, I don’t use their prices.

The Allstate offer and accept is x% off NAGS and the State Farm offer and accept is y% off NAGS and the Gotcha Good Network is only paying z% off NAGS!---- rather than who cares, I don’t use their prices. And if a network asks me to do a job for them, I will only do it at my price.

The TPA short paid me! What can I do?---- rather than: who cares, I send my bills to the insurance companies directly.

The insurance company short paid me! What can I do?---- rather than: I do not use NAGS pricing, the insurance companies never showed my pricing to be unreasonable, and I took them to court and won every time so they no longer short pay me.

Resume your babbling, sheep, and have faith that NAGS, TPA’s, and insurance companies will continue to love you and keep your best interests in their hearts, as long as you tow the mark.

I now climb the mountain and disappear into the clouds chanting, “I will bill off NAGS when Safelite bills off NAGS.” Amen.

1 2

Copyright © AGRR™/glassBYTEs™ All rights reserved.
20 PGA Drive, Suite 201, Stafford, Virginia 22554
540-720-5584 (P) 540-720-5687 (F) info@agrrmag.com
www.agrrmag.com / www.glassbytes.com