OK Got a questions for all my fellow Durantonians. What color was the firewall painted from the factory? Black or body color? Whats the general opinion?

Where Are You From? Oviedo, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1928 Durant Model 65 4 door

Mike,
In my Ford Model A restoration books they do not specify. But being these all were "assembly line" cars the Body was painted as a unit (with " doors, hood Pannels, trunk lids and similar items laid on horses or barrels and painted at at the same time as the body") to insure color match.

"Fenders and aprons painted (originally Dipped) in black".

"Two tone paint schemes were done prior to rubbing and polishing. Main body portion (and parts) painted first, then contrasting Belt color painted afterwards. Mask off area requiring second color with masking tape paying particular attention to keep line straight".

To quote further; About those colored WHEELS; "Prior to 1930 it was up to the individual Ford dealer to satisfy customers wanting colored wheels by painting factory "Black" wheels in his own shop. Black wheels were still standard equipment on all 1930 models (except for two late in the year) and remained so through most of 1931. In 1930 after much experminting with baked enamel...to be practical for volume production. ,...So in 1930 for the first time ...customers could order factory painted wheels in color for about $10 ($2 a wheel)".

Chevy pretty much followed this Painting scheme except they had painted wheels (Disc wheel option in mid 20's through 1930). In 1929 20" wire wheels were an option, then 1930 wood wheels were the option along with 19" Wire wheels optional. Disc wheels painted body color were pretty much standard after late 1928 till 1930, then mid 1930 Painted wire wheels on standard models (black) with deluxe wire models Colored came in late 1930, Disc and Wood wheels still an option, but out of fashion.

SHORT ANSWER to your question Paint the firewall Main body color.

Hope this helps you.
Lance C.

Where Are You From? Niceville, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1925 and 26 Locomobile JR-8's, 1928 Loco 8-70, 30 Durant 610

At our recently completed tour in Vancouver BC I noticed member Bruce Hargin (I believe he has a 1929), has a black firewall with what must be two sets of factory number/letter(s) stenciled onto the upper right hand side of the firewall. It was one letter and a two digit number. One was in white and the other in yellow, and one set was on upside down. Now that must be some original factory code, and the firewall was black. But his entire car was black! I have also seen some numbers such as these on member Jim Colbert's 6-14 sedan. The firewall was black, but then again his entire car was originally black also. Maybe someone can shed more light on this.

Where Are You From? Orygun

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1930 6-14

Speaking for the cars I know, I would say the firewall was always the main body color. The firewall on my 29 model 60 was painted the same as the body, Toranto Red. From a manufacturing standpoint it made sense to do it that way. I don't see any advantage to painting the firewall black.

Where Are You From? Fremont, CA

Do You own a car built by Durant? two of them

Mike: My 28 D75 has the original body paint which is the two tone medium/dark green. The firewall is the original black and is also the same black that is behind the serial number plate.

Where Are You From? Hyattsville, Md

Do You own a car built by Durant? Yes

Mike,
I think there you have your answer; the firewalls were painted Body color, since these were Assembly Line production cars! Henry (Ford) and the others would not waste production money and time painting the firewall again in black.

Any difference was most likely a re-paint to a different color later, Over the Original Black, probably since Black was such a common color then.

All original Model A's and early Chevys that I have seen had a Body color firewall. This was many seen in junkyards, backyards, and fields in the day.

Lance C.

Where Are You From? Niceville, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1925 and 26 Locomobile JR-8's, 1928 Loco 8-70, 30 Durant 610

Dorothy's firewall is same blue colour as the body. Makes sense while body is being painted to do the same rather than mask to do black on firewall. Then the chromed cowl stip was added later.

I have a few pages on painting from David Schulte for 30 - 32 and gives colour of 31 / 32 wheels for 510, 612, 614, 617 and 619. I sent a copy to Rick.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 614 sedan

Sounds good guys, I have been studying my firewall and it sure seemed like it was original factory type behind rubber grometts, number plate etc. But I think my car was restored sometime in the 50's, at least a partial restoration. My body color is the Ambata green which I think was one of the colors offered for the 28 model year for sedans. I'll defer to the experts and paint it green.

Where Are You From? Oviedo, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1928 Durant Model 65

Mike: I just want to reiterate what i have found on my car. When the grommets and serial plate were removed, i found the black paint to be the same in those areas as the rest of the firewall. Because of my knowledge of the car's history, it definitely is not a repaint but the original black color.

Where Are You From? Hyattsville, Md

Do You own a car built by Durant? Yes

Hello again,
With all due respect S. Blomquist, I agree that your firewall is the original Black color!

However have you pulled the rest of the Body apart completely (all hidden areas) to see if there is also "orignal Black" hidden there too, therefore the Body having been repainted Med/Dark Green? Perhaps even repainted over the Black at the Factory or at the Dealers before delivery for a special order? Maybe?

Recently I was working on a 1961 Corvette and found several layers of color & primer repaints, which really had us going on what was the original color?

However "hidden" under the windshield trim and wiper bezels I found the original color; interestingly it was Tuxedo Black the 3rd most popular color (12+% of total production) for the year. Thus making it a more rare Triple black colored sports car (Body, Interior and Top).

Lance C.

Where Are You From? Niceville, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1925 and 26 Locomobile JR-8's, 1928 Loco 8-70, 30 Durant 610

test

Mike, my car was the original blue color with the production numbers from the Oakland factory. Phil

Where Are You From? Portland, OR

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1929 Model 60

Test what Rick ?? I am not getting any notifys when I check the box when adding to others input. More glitches ??

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 614 sedan

No glitches Norm, the test I ran was a complete success.

Lance, I too have an original 28 model 75 (there are not too many of them) and the car came stock with two tone body paint: Brewster Green Rear body and Desert sand (on the hood and details around the windows). The firewall is black as was the fenders and everything up front. 1928 was the anniversary editions, and this being the top of the line model I guess it was supposed to be a jazzy looking car.
My father in law oversprayed ours so it is all black and pinstriped now.. guess that was the thing to do in 1964 :) The interior fabric also matched with a herringbone type two tone pattern.

Where Are You From? Southern VT

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1928 Durant model 75 and others :)

Carol,
Thank you for your comments, I think that you might have uncovered something! Both your car and S. Blomquist's cars were both two-tone color combinations. Perhaps the Durant company could not decide how or where to stop the 2nd colors on the body (without sending it through again to repaint the main color on the firewall).

So they elected instead to paint the firewalls (on Two-tone cars)Black while painting the Fenders and/or Splash aprons! Thus an easy convenient fix to the Firewall color problem. These car were more upscale than the Fords or Chevys so had larger two toned color areas than just the window surrounds on the lesser brands, thus more of a problem. So this might have been the solution for the firewall's color saving time and expense of another run through the assembly (paint) line.

In the August 2011 issue of Hemmings Classic Cars magazine on page 72, "I was there"; the author John Habelman describes how difficultt it was painting the 2 or 3 tone colors of the 50's cars on the assembly lines and how it really slowed up production using new or inexperienced painters(the line slowed down to; 25 to 35 units vs 60 units per hour). The line also slowed up because of changing colors,touch-ups & redo's etc. A Tri-color Rambler even had to run through the line 3 times, getting masked then painted with each color, 3 different times! Also Not a good idea for quick mass-production.

This may be something that we want to further research for the club! I wonder how other "upscale" brands did it? Thanks again for your and S. Blomquist's insights. We all learn something new everyday.
Lance C.

Where Are You From? Niceville, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1925 and 26 Locomobile JR-8's, 1928 Loco 8-70, 30 Durant 610

Another thought might be it depended what factory turned out the car, as to how they painted them. We've learned that factory A didn't use same parts as factory B for same models. Like its said no two cars the same.

Perhaps the "better" all new improved 1930's and up just painted firewalls body colour. Have to remember Durant was in decline by then and any way to shove out cars cheaper, would be to stop things like masking and repainting firewalls. Less paint and work. Its like the 407 created to get sales and cut expenses. Bumpers were an option on those to save customers money also. Front cross member reversed and longer shaft on water pump for fan. Theres a savings, same cross member as 6's and two less cyl's. No parking lights, like standard 6's had. Nothing worked and Durant failed early 1931, as we know.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 614 sedan

OK, I thought that I just might open the Durant factory can of worms. I know that in 1928 the top two models were the 65 and 75. The 75 was the largest and fanciest of the two, but the Model 65 was a bit more dressed up than the Model 55 & M-2. Guess I'll have to continue my research a bit more. I have got a feeling it's going to be what I like, since we can not find any documentation.

Where Are You From? Oviedo, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1928 Durant Model 65 4 door

Mike, don't forget the red /yellow flame decals down the sides of the car. ha ha

Nothing is simple with our cars. Why this black nonsense by Durant ? Was the inside of the hoods also black and body colour outside for pre 30's ?

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 614 sedan

I would guess that whoever stamped out the firewalls would paint them black before shipping to the various body builders. They would then be riveted or spotwelded to the cowl. The body builder would probably not bother to repaint the firewall, except perhaps to order for the more expensive bodies. The fact that fenders, splash pans, etc., were painted black, was so that the dealers could make easy repairs after a "fender-bender". No painting required.

Do You own a car built by Durant? yes

Cdmn,
Good points that you and Norm make that we may have all forgotten. The Durants were mass-produced cars at a price. And any way to lessen price was probably followed, so; "Make Them" as Quick as possible!

Durants as well as most others and the big ones too(i.e. Ford & Chevrolets) in the 20's were made as cheap and quickly as possible! That is why Fenders, Splash aprons, and most all Wheels were Black...to save money; "crank them out"! Plus Black dried quicker and was uniform so this also allowed quicker volume production! Thus Ford's ole MODEL T motto; "Any color you want as long as it's Black"

Most of us in the car hobby and restoring old cars today forget that the objects of our affection were just mass produced transportation devices. Made as cheap and as quick as possible in volume, to turn a maxium profit per unit, for their company.

Lance C.

Where Are You From? Niceville, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1925 and 26 Locomobile JR-8's, 1928 Loco 8-70, 30 Durant 610

Don't know if this assembly line photo from the Lancing plant may be of help...It appears that they were using a firewall numbering system on the early Durants as Ross has previously mentioned...On this touring car there is a numbering system on a black firewall, the body appears to be of a lighter tone(either primer or a lighter than black paint)I am wondering if this may be more arguement that the firewalls on at least some models were black regardless of what color the body was to be painted? Or I guess that the numbering system could be on a darker color waiting for a trip back to the paint shop for the final matching color....Anyway, food for thought.

Where Are You From? Leavenworth, WA / Yuma, AZ

Do You own a car built by Durant? A-22 / model 40 / Flint

After taking another look at this black and white factory picture I am thinking now that if this firewall was painted black it would appear more of a match in color to the black seats, sooo if that is the case I would vote that the firewall is painted a dark color and at some point the body will be painted the same...Whatcha think.

Where Are You From? Leavenworth, WA / Yuma, AZ

Do You own a car built by Durant? A-22 / model 40 / Flint

It doesn't look like the workers had any kind of matching uniforms, and what are they doing, just scooting the bodies along? There seems to be some kind of track system, but the body doesn't look like it's on it. Then the seats look installed, and then they paint the car? Those guys had it all wrong didn't they? At least Ford had a moving assembly line!Ross

Where Are You From? Orygun

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1930 6-14