OKAY GENTLEMEN....WE HAVE A MEMBER IN NEED.
HE IS IN NEED OF A RIM FOR AN M-2 DURANT 2 DOOR SEDAN (WOOD WHEEL).JUST THE RIM...IT MEASURES ONLY 3 1/2 INCHES ACROSS TOP OUTER EDGE FROM SIDE TO SIDE....MOST OTHERS HE FINDS MEASURE MORE LIKE 4 INCHES...CAN ANYBODY TELL US WHAT IS THE PROBLEM ? I THINK THE M-2 WAS A 4 CYL STAR OF 1927 CALLED AN M-2 DURANT IN 1928....ARE THE WHEELS STAR SIZED OR SOMETHING /????? DOES ANYONE HAVE ONE OF THESE 3 1/2 " RIMS.....TIME IS A FACTOR SO PLEASE SPEAKUP...THE RIM HAS TO BE SENT TO NEW YORK ADDRESS.FOR OUR CANADIAN FRIEND JAMES...PLEASE HELP ME HELP OUR FELLOW DURANTONIAN IN HIS MOMENT OF NEED...IT IS HE ONLY THING KEEPING HIM FROM DRIVING DOWN THE ROAD....THANX, REGARDS, GARY KAUFFMAN
Can't help but seems to me Jim Hall of Aylmer Que with 28 D roadter was also looking for that smaller sized rim. Had an ad in Partner last year looking for one. The 28 is smaller than 29.
ah, well why didn't ya say so at 1st .. sheesh. All that NY address stuff. (yes cross border problems again so US post office and pick up there. Worse now without a passport to cross to the US as of Jan)
Haven't met Jim yet since the 60's but hes across the Ottawa River from me. His e addy is wrong in the ad in Partner. "Sympatico" not what is shown. ahall000@sympatico.ca. His wife Ann does the emails but prefers a phone call.
Seems the 28 is 3 1/2 inch wide and 29 is 4 inch wide. Typical D's lets not make everything the same. He's got 3 just missing the 4th.
Gary & Norm:
I believe you can use a Model T Ford rim. All you need to do is redrill the hole for the valve stem. There should be enough Model T rims around Aylmer that he could try one and see if this is possible. The 3 1/2 inch rim fits a 23 inch wheel and the 4 inch rim fits a 21 inch wheel, but the OD of both are 30 inches. The 3 1/2 inch rim takes a 30 x 3.5" tire. The 4.5 inch rim takes a 21" x 4.5 inch tire) (3.5 + 3.5 +23 = 30) (4.5 + 4.5 +21 = 30)
Gord
Hummm Gord, I wonder what Jim has. I was told it was a 28 roadster (didn't keep the pics Steve sent me or can't find them) Per Terry's site that M2 takes 28 x 4 1/2 oversized balloon tires. M4 also the same. 40 same. 60 29 x 5.00.
Lost me on all this. I know Steve's 60 has 4.75 / 5.00 x 19 as I have his old ones on Dorothy until I can afford the correct ones or 5.25 / 5.50 x 19 used only on 32 Durant's, per Simco Tire books on all car makes tires (and was on the car when I got it). Questioned Simco on it and they have the old books and for some reason 28 - 31 D's have 4.75 / 5.00 x 19. (orig 4.75 x 19) 1932 D's only the bigger.
Per my Ford T book 1925 was 1st year for 21 x 4.40 balloon tires as optional equipment at $25, standard was the 30 clinchers but demountable rims for the 1st time on all body styles. 1926 it was standard 21 x 4.40 and the clincher rim / tires were gone.
Jim's tires are 19's its the rim for some reason is 3 1/2 wide not the 4 1/2 the 28 / 29's have. He / we could have gotten 4 1/2 rims from a number of sources.
Norm:
That would make a very small wheel diameter. 19 x 3 1/2 would be 26" I would be interested in knowing the tire size that is printed on the tires he has on the other three wheels, or the size he expects to mount on this replacement rim. I wonder if the tire is 3.5/4.5 - 19 which is a different animal again. The 3.5 is the cross section, the 4.5 is the depth and the 19 the diameter of the wheel.
Gord
Intersting to note rereading your mail Gord about 3 1/2 / 4 1/2 x 19 being across and depth. I was talking to Simco tire and Lucas tire, last year ,and both told me there were tires at one time that were 4.75 x 19 and 5.00 x 19 which were combined into one and called 4.75 / 5.00 x 19 to cover both. (same with Dorothys 5.25 x 5.50 x 19). Where you see both numbers they are combined tire sizes.
I do recall the T (490 Chevy and other makes) tires 30 x 3 and 30 x 3 1/2. I do also recall the 5.00 x 19's. Think Stephans 31 D had one of those in the 60's when it came from the Middleville shed. Looked out of place with the 4.75 /5.00 ones. I think one of Dorothys was 5.50 x 19 before I switched to the samller tires for now. Had a heck of a time getting it off the rim or even trying to cut the bead to get it off. I won ,the old tire didn't, but neither did two hacksaw blades. grin.
I would feel that those tires would be too big for that narrow a rim. I will see what sort of reference I can come up with, and consult with other tire people also. In the meantime, keep looking for a narrow rim.
Gord
From all the digging we have done, we have found the following:
The M2, Model 55 and Model 65 for 1928 share the same rim, Durant part number 24304, does not give rim size
The Model 40, 60, 63 and 66 for 1929 share the same rim, Durant part number 26301 and the parts book indicates that this is a 4" rim.
I would assume that that they found that the rim number 24304 was too narrow and suffered from split rims, and that that is one of the reasons for going to a different rim.
We also found out that the rim bolts for the 24304 rim are 2 11/16" and the rim bolts for the 26301 rim are 2 13/16" . Doesn't seem like much, but does indicate a narrower rim.
I would imagine that the narrow rims are scarcer than hens teeth.
Gord
gentlemen, you are awesome durantonians, .I just spoke to jim and he gratefully acknowledges all you are doing to help him solve his wheel problem. he said the T wheel did not work. i offered to find 4 new wheels but with all the work in the spokes and rims done, he is hoping for a "rim " solution because he would be hard pressed to do another set of spokes. if it is necessary, he will try to find a good machine shop that can split and reduce a rim's measurement to what he needs...but....keep on going and keep eyes open for an available 3 1/2" rim for him....
thanx and regards, gary k
There you go Gord, sort of the alpha and omega with 28 - 32 D's. Jim can't find his scarce parts for the 28 like my 32 only parts. Where are those hens teeth ?? Can't imagine finding parts for the two remaining 33's of 8 built. Forget hens teeth, just none existant.
I found my mail from Simco from Jan a year back, below.
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I have a book that tells me all cars original equipment size too, and my book says that a 1932 Durant takes a 5.25-19 tire. The 30 / 31's took the 500-19 as your book shows but not the 32's, must have been some reason for changing.
Anyways, in answer to your question about the difference between a 4.75 and a 5.00, there really isn't any difference. In fact, all tires now come as a 4.75/5.00-19 combo tire for all applications. So do your 5.25 tires.
We have a 5.25/5.50-19 Excelsior blackwall available for $155.00 each.
We also have 5.50-19 BFGoodrich with a 3 1/4" whitewall for $258.00 each.
As for tubes they are $32.00 each.
I read in a DFR magazine that Durants were equiped with Kelsey or Bimmel wheels in 1928.I believe the wider Kelsey wheels are the most popular. I think the Bimmel takes the narrow rim as the felloe is narrower as are the spokes. A restorer was looking for the narrow wheel rim here in Australia a few years ago. I had many rims in my collection, but no narrow ones
Sid
aaaahhhaaaahhh! our latest revelation......
bimmel rims are narrower......let us see where that leads us......i think i will have to make a library run to see if Phila Auto Collection can help us.....only time will tell...and we are running out of time.....regards, gary k
DAVE,
THE FOLLOWING ADDRESS IS WHERE TO SEND THE RIM....
TO: JAMES HALL
c/o THE U.P.S. STORE
2981 FORD STREET
OGDENSBURG, N.Y. 13669
IF YOU CALL ME AT YOUR CONVENIENCE I WILL SET UP
REIMBURSEMENT FOR YOU FROM JAMES FOR COST AND/OR SHIPPING.
MANY THANX, GARY K
MY CELL # 610-256-3255
HOME # 610-279-3116