After reading this article...
http://www.crm2day.com/news/crm/120622.php

...isn't there some way to prove price fixing or collusion when Mitchell has HUGE dealings with the insurance industry and also owns NAGS, a tool that is used to "fix" pricing in our industry?

I just can't believe there is nothing we can do about this relationship and abuse of NAGS as a tool. There has to be a lawyer or team of them out there somewhere that would help us all attain that "fair and balanced" playing field we all desperately want. We just have to find the $$$ in it to convince him/her it is worth their time.

Did anybody read the last story from Bob B of State Farm? He point blank said as long as a policyholder can walk in of the street and get a price lower than the offer and acceptance (read the glassbytes interview Nov 17th) they will continue to lower pricing. We are our own enemies. Are their prices fair and reasonable? Compaired to cash pricing, I would say way better. WOuld you want to explain the differances to a judge. Good Luck, except maybe in Minnesota................

I will explain it to a judge no problem.

When I have to fight with a TPA, they blame ins. co. for non-payment, the ins. co. says they paid the TPA blaming them, etc. etc. for months on end, I can easily explain why ins. pricing is higher than cash.

I will also explain how my cash pricing is fair and reasonable, based on a fair mark-up over my part costs, yet the insurance company prices (that THEY determine "independently") are all over the board.

How can Bob get mad when he pays $200 and other ins. co. pay me $500 for the exact same glass parts?? He can't. Noone in the ins. industry can justify their own pricing, nor will disclose where they get their pricing from. So I turn it back on them, and ask the Judge to have the ins. co. disclose their pricing structure and tell the judge why I should be held to that?

So yes, I will tell the judge how I arrive at my prices, why my cash is the lowest price structure, why I charge more for ANY customer I bill on account, and why I bill insurance companies even more than that (because of the increased administrative fees incurred despite thousands of dollars spent on computers and EDI services like the insurance industry asked us to).

It is simple Mr. Judge. It costs me a considerable amount more to verify coverage, call the TPA, process the invoice (EDI or direct), and sit and wait while the TPA collects interest $$$ on MY FUNDS, due to ME.

Sorry, but I do not think it is that difficult to explain. I think it is more ABSURD that the ins. co. want a CASH price. How many of you tell the insurance company "I want to pay my premium month-to-month, but want to be billed the same amount as the guy who pays annually"? Yet that is what the ins. co. want. They want to pay us in 20 to 60 days, but get the CASH price. Someone tell me that is not CRAZY!!!

BTW - I am not talking about charging $200 cash for a part, and $900 to the insurance company for that same part. Absurd is absurd, and I do not think anyone could explain that kind of $$$ difference.

But if you base your CASH price off of a fair and reasonable (industry norm) cost+, and the ins. co. wants to continue to use NAGS (will all of its flaws), then why is it YOUR problem if they are paying to much? They set their OWN PRICE don't they.

And like I have said before, we always extend our CASH price to each and every agent when we call to verify coverage. As long as he will come over when the vehicle is picked up, pay us in full (cash,check,credit card even) we will be happy to give him the same CASH price "customers off the street" get.

Have a happy day everyone, and MAKE MONEY

gotta love those verticle markets. ha ha.

didn't they used to call that kind of stuff verticle monopolies?

RALPIE,

One other point (harp, harp) or (rub, rub)

If Mr. Bob was actually BUYING our services, what he says MIGHT be valid.

But being that the Farm is NOT contracting for repairs with shops, he has NO standing to stand in the buyer's shoes and demand the price discounts.

Bold words indeed, coming from a man that knows that the Farm does not owe the shop one thin dime.

Check your O/A and tell me where it says that the Farm promises to pay you anything. Bet you will find lots of language stating "the shop promises to..." or "the shop agrees to....." but not much of what the Farm promises or agrees to do.

Think about it.

JMHNLO

CCC, there is another version of this same article that says that the 'resource' they are 'dispatchting' the 'assignments' to are adjusters.

I noted when I first saw this that the version you posted does not say that...

Dontcha' just wonder what 'resources' will be being 'dispatched' 'assignments' to?

And this has nothing to do with competing with Metryx....nope, not a chance. It just sounds the same that's all....just a coincidence.

Mark1 - Sounded to me like this program was created to conpete with GLAXIS. Software that allows on-line, real-time dispatching, FNOL, and authorizations(still not sure why we need to get anything AUTHORIZED, as the customer already has contracted with us to do the work.)

Do you remember if AGRR has ever done a poll on what software glass shops are using for invoicing and billing? I know some use all EDI services, others manually enter their paper invoices into sites like SGC, etc. They might even include shops using direct billing(fax,email) and paper billing. Might be interesting to know this?

, has everyone registered their shop on the CAGG website, they need us now more than ever if they are going to be successful in changing the pricing benchmark for the AGR industry.

ahag, you mentioned yesterday that you had had no response from CAGG on your emails, has that changed? If not try again, I got an answer to mine.

CCC

The scary part is if the software is deciding how to allocate these resources and assignments.....

Now, we've got a computer program deciding where jobs go....that's the question.

REmember all those "installer qualification questions" that included how many vans you have, the areas you service, the vin numbers on the vans, ect ect....and many were asking what that had to do with a industry credentialing services registry that spoke of qualifications, perhaps lending too much credence to the number of employees and the areas you service?

Is the software being, or will it be, used to decide how much work your shop can handle at any given moment, by someone that isn't even within a couple thousand miles of your day to day biz?

Oh well, I'm sure it's only about those customers that don't have a choice of shop.....right????

mark1 - LOL of course.

I do believe some insurance companies want to or at least want to appear that they are providing a service to the policyholder by having "approved providers" or "network participants" because many policyholders do not know where to have services performed.

Some policyholders we talk to do ask and trust their agents for referals because they believe he is an expert, not knowing very few agents know about auto glass, body and paint, etc. Agents and ins. co. do not want to look stupid by not having providers to "reccommend".

However, in many cases, ins. co. have used these "lists" to steer policyholders to the cheapest "participants" (customized offer?) and not to the service provider with the highest creditentials or LOWEST WARRANTY RATE. In my opinion WARRANTY RATE should be the one of the highest qualifier as it saves the ins. co money, saves the policyholder time, and leads to higher customer/policyholder satisfaction. Customer satisfaction may be the largest concern the auto glass industry and insurance industry have in common, it just seems we have two very different ideas of how to attain it.

I always remind our customers, that even though we are on the "approved list" many times, all it means is that at this time we agree, or in some cases, do not agree with the insurance companies dictated pricing. In the future, we may or may not be on their "approved list" because because those prices fluctuate so when an insurance company's dictated price gets to low, we drop off their "approved list" in order to maintain our high quality installation standards and help insure the customers SAFETY.

Many times this gets a cute smile from customers as they understand that some companies may not pay enough to have their windshield replaced properly. They always ask if their insurance is one that does or does not. Then, if asked, we are always more that happy to pass on our "list" of companies that do pay enough to SAFELY replace a windshield, pay timely, and from our experience, understand what customer satisfaction is all about.

Just becuase glass company A gives lowball street pricing that does not mean that a TPA or insurance company can force every glass company in the country to lower thiers

SB - I beg to differ. I believe they already are because the auto glass industry is not unified and has no TRUE national association to pull us all together, fight for US, and be OUR representative to the insurance industry.

Look at minnesota where they got organized, fought for their hard labor, and now they have much more control and have had measures set in place that do not allow the ins. co. to use ANY low-ball price to determine pricing. They have to compare "like products and service".

Until that happens, THEY will continue to use shop A's low-ball price to determine your price. And they will push and push and push until enough of us fight back either thru legislative means or by discontinuing services to their insureds.

Just my very humble opinion.

SB - case in point. We installed a DW01341GBYN on 09/2002 pre-tax amount for StateFarm was $313, just installed one today for LYNX/Statefarm $280.

I am sure this makes Bob smile, but it is just one example of how we have allowed the insurance industry and some in our industry to erode pricing. Some would argue that this is good for the consumer, but I would argue that is far from reality, as in most cases it is the insurance company that benefits from lower claims $$$. Has your insurance premium dropped 11% since 2002?? I doubt it. And I know our costs are more to perform these services in 2006 than they were in 2002.

So we MUST take back control. It starts NOW, and it will be a LONG fight, but it can and will be won.

BOy you sure like to beat bob down, how about we be mean to somone else... like that other guy...