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Headlig lens and bezels

Looking for headlight lens and bezels for the 1929 D40. I have one bezel in rough shape that I could make work and there are lens available but no rims. Any one out there with one or two?

Where Are You From? Lombardy, Ontario

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1929 D40

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Headlight lenses for 40, 60, 401 are plain glass 9 3/8 diameter. The reflector is ribbed to take the place of the refraction in the normal lenses. Should be able to get any glass Co cut a round lense.
Perhaps Burchill Glass in Perth. or http://centennialglass.com/about/areas/perth/ who seem to make anything.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Interesting! There was one broken lens with the car that was plain glass but I noticed all the Fords, Chev's etc. have an actual lens, so I assumed that the Durant would also. Burchell glass has made stuff for me and they could probably do the job. Dave's auto glass in Smiths Falls cut my windshield and did a good job at reasonable cost. The bezels are going to be a problem because the Fords, Chevs and Dodges had smaller lights. Thanks for the info.

Jim

Where Are You From? Lombardy

Do You own a car built by Durant? "29 D40

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Never assume anything with Billy's cars, ha ha.

1930 US / Can / 1931 US, had Glolite lights / lenses 944 GL 9 7/16 x 8 1/2. So one would assume the fender light lenses on Special / Deluxe would be Glolite also to match. Nope Depress Beam 1179 3 x 2 3/4. Can 1931 / 32 are Depress Beam lights / lenses 11471 9 5/16 x 8 1/2 so now fender light lense match.
I got the lights but wrong doors for the 32 and as luck would have it Tim Orr had one door in Brampton and I got a second at Stirling flea market. Needed a 11471 lense and got a mint one off eBay in Toronto. Slipped through my hands and smashed to bits aughhhh. Went to Odessa flea market and vendor had one for $20 (if not too much. Said price was just fine)

I do know the 30 / 31 Chevy lenses fit our Glolite as I used to pick up the lenses for my 1930 614 at the time. Had a stack of headlight lenses in the 60's off Durant / Chevy's.

Few years back the Sunday flea market in Smiths Falls, one vendor had a ribbed reflector head light in his space. Friend of mine went down a week later to see about the light for his 60 and a vendor was asking him what he was looking for. Turned out the vendor had a wire wheel hub cap for my 32 at home. Vendor went home and got it. So you just never know.

With all the 40 / 60's made there must be doors for your 40, out there.

This is too bad as he has a 1937 book on his site I have used many times for lenses and what used on.
Don's Bulbs
www.donsbulbs.com/cgi-bin/r/t.pl
Don has retired, and donsbulbs is permanently closed --- No plans yet on possible future liquidating of assets. If anything changes in the future, news will be posted here.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Please don't use the headlight Lens size chart In our Technical Page without First double checking with an alternate source...The size listed for Jim's 1929 D-40 is 7" dia. rather than the correct 9 3/8"dia...In an old addition of the "Durant standard" (Volume 20- number 4- 1996), There is a 3 Page Parts Interchange chart for Head Lamps and Related Parts (Durant, Devaux, Flint,Frontenac,Star and Rugby) listing part numbers and description for various models and in most cases listing the Lens Diameters...Cross checking the Headlight lens sizes In the Tec. Page Chart to the Sizes listed in the Durant's Standard, I am only finding one lens that compairs and that is for the model 60 ....So not sure whats going on but think it should be looked into....I would like to see these 3 pages of Head Lamp information added to our Technical Page if at all possiable.

A couple examples from the Interchange:

P/N 26401....Model- M4,S4,40,60,401 Headlamp Lens...(9-3/8" dia)
P/N 25240....Model- 55,63,65,66,406,407,615,618,E-618,619, 670...Headlamp lens (8-1/2" dia) (Glolite)(Canadian 65)

Where Are You From? Leavenworth, WA / Yuma, AZ

Do You own a car built by Durant? Several

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Bill .. didn't even know that list of errors was in Tech section but not surprised Unlike the US aftermarkets which are silent on headlights the Can ones do give headlights / lenses for what models. Part of Can aftermarket.

The 8 1/2 refers to the inner diameter not outer. Would be interesting to see if your listing is correct if Jeff is involved.

What I have quoted is correct. If Don's Bulb's was still online you would see our Depress Beam is correct as well for the Canadian 31 / 32 .. 407, 416, 614, 615. 616, 618, 633, E 618, E 670, 685. The 1933 Fronty C-400 / C-600 used same size as 31 / 32 but convex Depress Beam 12887. ( I have a pair of 12887).
Part number for 31 / 32 Can Depress Beam 11471 is 43637.

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Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

It appears to me to be taken out of an interchange book?, no Idea who was involved....Their are two sizes listed for P/N 25240 and two for P/N 24979 for some reason some models are listed with inside diams and some are listed with outside diameters? They do seam to match with your list...So How about Norm putting together an accurate lens chart for the Tech Page...Thanks Norm!


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Where Are You From? Leavenworth, WA / Yuma, AZ

Do You own a car built by Durant? Several

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Definitely 93/8 OD and 8 1/2 ID. Where do I find a couple?

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Oh no you don't rope me into now doing lenses lists. I haven't the resources to touch that one. I'm still struggling with Rugby truck vins and time frames 1930 and later. Don't go by Terry's site where he shows S4 with two crests as an example nor 1931. The 406 Rugby brochure undated is 406 / S4 on the cover with the 30 crest. Had Terry not just copied brochure covers from various sources but actually seen entire brochure, the 406 is 1930 style but the S4 is unchanged and still same parts / rad / crest as when it first came out 1928. 401 doesn't have both 29 / 30 crest but unchanged until the 401 became the 406. I'm running into same thing with the 615 where the dash didn't update 1931 and later like the cars, but used the 30 dash and square pulls. Seeing photos of the few existing 615's you can see nothing got changed. Truck was a truck I guess and cars got fancied up a bit.

While on that same topic of mis info look at Tech page Rugby Truck serials. Right out to lunch. Statement at top about Rugby coming out Sept 1928 ?? No only the M2 Durant split Sept / Oct 1928 to M4 Durant and S4 Rugby, Rugby truck came out April 1 1928 with the L, T, X. Rest of info on that page forget it. X wasn't 1929 but 28 starting at 1001, 616 came out 1931 no 1930's. Again the 401 1929 at 1001. Really and what happened to the May 1928 to July 31, 1928's ? etc etc

I'm just saying take things with a grain of salt until one does proper research. Even books of the time are with errors. This one of yours is missing models and taking info from other sources that may or may not be accurate.

Don's bulb's 1937 book I used many times and now wish I had copied the pages on, was not accurate also. I recall it just copied the US to Can line of Durant's that used the 11471 Depress Beam. The 610. 612, 619 were not make in Canada. It missed the 407 in both US / Can lines.

Don's bulb's book was great with lense type and both sizes (inner / outer) flat or convex, part number. Other pages said what a lense fit, or you could go by make and it gave you lense and year used.

I was thinking on it and its possible if you knew your door size was 8 1/2 opening then many makes of lense with 8 1/2 inner diam might fit that door, but would the door allow the lense spring clamps to work holding the glass or even room for them in the door. Remember our Depress
Beam is bigger outside diam so might not even have room for the clamp wires to fit inside the Glolite doors.

Don't know the reasoning why Durant Motor's used Glolite, Dominion Motors used only Depress Beam on all vehicles it made 31 - 33, De Vaux / Continental used Stabilite of various sizes 31 - 34.

I missed the 1931 611 on my Depress Beam, if such a car was ever made. It was to mirror the 614, ads on it, has vin ranges, yet none exist. Doesn't seem to make sense to have two identical cars with different model numbers. Probably died before any made.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Burchell or Dave's auto for lenses :smile: Ribbed reflectors do the work of the none plain lenses.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Jim Cooke
Definitely 93/8 OD and 8 1/2 ID. Where do I find a couple?
Jim,

The original lenses for the 40 were "plain Glass 9-3/8 OD" and would have been flat glass with no inside shoulder...On my model 40 I am not using flat glass but found a set of shouldered lenses with a Lighthouse design and they look and fit quite nicely....so, If you wanted to go that route probably the demintions you stated would work fine (+ 0r - a 1/16") keep in mind that if the glass is too thick you may have problems getting the bezel/doors back on......Keep an eye on ebay or swap meets for lenses.

Where Are You From? Leavenworth, WA / Yuma, AZ

Do You own a car built by Durant? Several

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Thanks Bill & Norm. I found a neighbour who does stain glass windows who can cut me some lenses and I got a call last night from a DMAC member who has the bezels. Every once in a while things work out.
Jim

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Thanks Bill for this posting. In most pictures I see the back of the headlight bucket painted black. My Model 65 has the Glo-lite bucket and lens with the gold plated piece in front of the bulb. It's age tarnished (the bucket) but I can not see any trace of chrome or nickel plating anywhere. The sales brochure for the model 65 says many parts are "the new chrome". On your list I see you can get them in nickel so I guess that's what it will be and I have the proof now I need and it answered my questions.

Where Are You From? Oviedo, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1928 Durant Model 65 4 door sedan from Elizabeth, NJ Plant

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Be careful Mike ... this partial listing doesn't show the painted lights for 65 if you are seeing black paint inside. Like the Leaside aftermarket shows the 65 can be 9 1/2 or 10 1/2 light / doors. Bill's shows both also. Note Leaside says 9 1/2 door is nickel plated and 10 1/2 is chrome plated. The 9 1/2 bucket is nickel per Leaside.

Note the deluxe 65 in Brazil has painted pots and nickel doors. Your 65 seems to have same thing.

Its unfortunate the US aftermarkets on lamps says nothing at all for lamps, and cowl lamps is hard to find on page 22 but is just a mention "Cowl, Side Lamps, with brackets, black and chrome Per pair 90 cents. Tail Lamps get same small mention and all models $1.85.
Leaside devotes two pages to headlights / tail lights / cowl and fender lights.

That's great Jim .. sometimes things just fall into place.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

This is a good example of mis info from period books, and why you need to do proper research what our vehicle originally had. Bill's list shows errors lumping our cars under part 25240 Glolite instead of 43637 Hall Depress Beam. Why they have two lines for 25240 ?? That gives the outside diam of the 944-GL for 614 and line above gives inside diam of same lense on the other models, even if wrong models like Fronty and 31 / 32 Durant / Rugby Can. Again don't take this list either as correct as errors jump out, models missing. It might be same idea as the Continental engines info done in the 60 / 70's ?? and re published in two Partner mags a year or so back that was incorrect.

Durant_lenses

First off the 65 and 75 are 1928 and one lense used was the 944-GL That one quoted might be the 10 1/8 Glolite lense.
Next line has these models coming out 1929, 30, 31. Nope not 1929 but 30 / 31 US and missing 406, 407. Plus 1930 Canada 406, 407, 614, 615 using 944-GL
617 line should say Twilite lense not Glolite (I don't know lense number for the 10 1/8 lense).
Next line they copy the other line and say Canada only 1931 / 32. We didn’t make the 610, 612, 619 and it should say 406, 407, 416, 611, 614, 615, 616, 618, 633 that used the 11471 Hall Depress Beam

Now drop to Durant Truck which should say Rugby not Durant.
1930 617 ?? No 617 truck made, its a car and mentioned above with its incorrect lense. Also the truck info is already is under Durant even if incorrect that it should be as I stated US 30 – 31 / Can 30 944-GL and 31 –32 Can as 11471-H

We picked up on vin books being incorrect saying the 1933 Ace and Frontenac Ace are model 81. Thanks to Daryl owning Aces but one a Frontenac Ace that constant myth was wrong. The Frontenac Ace is 91. Hayes body plates US are 181 but 191 Can. VIN plates on both show 81 or 91 as model. There was an very rusty Ace on eBay about a year back in the US but it had the Hayes plate 191 proving it was a Fronty Ace.

Its like the slogan "Buyer Beware" when using info other sources. Or "Measure Twice, Cut Once" if you don't do check first what was used. Makes it even more awkward when each US plant did its own thing and Can used other parts as well on same models. The beehive lense is a good example used some 28 / 29 plus 1931 US however all 1930 - 32 Canada Durant / Frontenac. US had winter front rads and not even an option here. Head lights as stated is another example 31 US and 31 Can on D's and R's.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Super nice set of 29 Durant headlamps, complete, on Ebay. Best I've seen in a long while.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Antique-1929-Durant-Headlights/273128126552?hash=item3f97b47858:g:kykAAOSweq5auDhG&vxp=mtr

Where Are You From? Texarkana, TX

Do You own a car built by Durant? Several plus 1

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Very interesting posts Bill and Norm. My model 65 came with, and I believe them to be the original ones on the car a set of nickel or chrome glo-lites. These also have the small parking lite bulbs inside the reflector and a diffuser or piece of copper with a cup that extends from the top to the bottom of the reflector that was gold plated. Some years ago I went through the same thing, as I contacted Carol our Editor who sells lenses for a lot of different cars and purchased a set of glo-lite lenses from her. She looked them up and her books, whatever they were, showed the 10 1/8 lens. When I got them back from Auburn that year, they were the wrong size for my buckets and I had to exchange them for the 9 7/8 size. If you watch EBAY Durant lenses come up there from time to time. Since the time I bought them from Carol I have even found the glo-lite ones and I do think they are the 944 GL lenses.

Where Are You From? Oviedo, Florida

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1928 Durant Model 65 4 door sedan from Elizabeth, NJ Plant

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

I saw the lenses on Ebay and they are nice. I will probably go with clear lense as suggested by Norm and Bill. I have a stain glass window maker as a neighbour who can cut them for me.

Jim

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Hi Mike .. will this help you with your decision ... Think you mean 9 7/16 x 8 1/2 944GL where the 10 1/8 is 988GL. If you have 9 7/8 it won't fit the 9 1/2 door ha ha. Odd the R was nickel plated but when it became the 55 Jan 1 1928 it was chrome plated as are the other models except the 65 which also came out Jan 1 1928.

This is out of our Leaside catalogue showing the 65 as nickel plated lights with the 9 7/16 lense. The 65 has its own rad and rad shell but doesn't say if nickel or chrome plated. Cowl lights 65 / 75 can be 3 1/2 or 4 1/2 outside diam but don't say nickel or chrome plated. This I think is a clue. Few lines down 75 is by itself saying 4 1/2 chrome plated. That to me is saying the others are nickel plated. ah ha taillights 65 / 75 are nickel plated but 75 can be chrome plated. I think your 65 is on its own with nickel plating everywhere.

IMG_3

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Yes nice looking lights but not Durant. Depress Beam used at Dominion Motors 31 - 33 but not Durant Motors vehicles. None of our lights have that raised tail on the upper bucket nor that door top. Doors on ours are 9 3/4 outside dia. for Depress Beam.

Looking at cars they appear to be REO Flying Cloud

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Yes Norm,

I noticed that as well, I was looking all through our photo page and couldn't find any match, they are the ball type but have a raised trim strip on the top..... 1930 407 was the only thing that had came close, they have something raised on the door?.... I haven't looked at other brands.

Where Are You From? Leavenworth, WA / Yuma, AZ

Do You own a car built by Durant? Several

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

I think those Headlights on Ebay are 1932 Packard.....Their is a pair on Ebay that look the same but are not as good of shape and the guy is asking $1200.00 bucks....So If I am right someone could buy the set of "Durant" listed Headlights and re-list them and make a proffit of over a thousand bucks...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1932-Packard-Antique-Brass-Era-Depress-Beam-C-M-Hall-Headlights-Headlamps-31-33-/322847216661

Where Are You From? Leavenworth, WA / Yuma, AZ

Do You own a car built by Durant? Several

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Hi Bill .. the eBay 1932 Packard ones have same idea but wider at 10 7/8 than the other eBay pair at 10 inch. Fastening part is completely different as well. Is it my imagination that the pricy lights don't match ? One has painted fastening area the other chrome. Google images show the 1930, 31, 32 Packard's with same idea maybe lesser models might have the 10 inch lights and fastening like our 1930 - 32 lights ??

I knew I had seen those 10 inch lights somewhere but off what ? First thing came to mind was Desoto but couldn't find any on Google images of Desoto with them. Tried a few more makes with same results. Hit the 1929 Reo Flying cloud and sure looks the same idea but ??
https://classics.autotrader.com/classic-cars/1929/reo/flying_cloud/100953893

If we knew the lense size and Don's Bulbs site was still up with the 1937 book, it probably would give us an idea what vehicles used that lense size to narrow it down.

Our 30 - 32 Durant can have the peak adornment which mirrors the 3 spears motif found everywhere on the 1930, rad cap, crank hole cover, in and out door handles, robe rail ends, pull straps fastenings, dash spears, 614 with spear hood vents, some like my old 614 Special had stainless steel V strips on the rad front. Our 1930 407 had plain handles similar, but not same, as US 1931 619. I understand the Oakland 407 used the 614 spear handles. Less spears on the 31 / 32. My 32 only rad cap and crank hole cover with spears. 1930 Essex inside handles, 32 Durant only, but outside handles I haven't uncovered what. 619 in same boat with cap only and V rad that won't take the flat crank hole cover. One of the Durant upgrades 1931 model year starting Jan 1 1931 different dash plate, pulls, handles, etc.

You could also buy the peak adornment's to add to your lights. Butters boys cast them. Drill a hole in your door tops and attach them, same as factory.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

Norm,

I think it's back to the drawing board for both of us.....It looks to me that the '29 Cloud has more of a "teardrop" shape, rather than the ball shaped "Durant listing" also that ornimatation on the top of the headlight door I think is slightly different.....On the '32 Packard lights the Ball shaped buckets and headlight doors look identical to the "Durant's", but like you say the mounting is different....Who knows how the seller may have measured the Durant listed lights (maybe inside the door rather than overall?).....Both the packard lights look the same to me other than one is held together with duct tape,...Imagine $1200.00 and held together with Duct Tape!!

About a 100 years ago I owned both a '29 Flying Cloud and a'29 Wolverine....I spent my whole income tax refund ($800.00 dollars) to pay for the Cloud....Didn't have any room in the garage for either of them so threw some plastic over them and they sat in the driveway over the winter...The next Spring the wife goes Yak Yak get them the H out of here...So thought I would sell the low end Wolverine and keep the Cloud...A young feller came by to look at the Wolverine and I made the mistake of letting him see the Cloud, so now he didn't want the Woverine he had to have the Cloud...After he pestered me for about a half hour I threw out a rediculous price of $1600 dollars (twice what I paid) to get rid of him...Well, he said I'll be back....That kid went to his folks, his aunts and uncles, anybody he could think of and came up with the rest of the cash that he needed to buy the car....I would guess that Flying Cloud would be worth a few sheckles today..

Where Are You From? Leavenworth, WA / Yuma, AZ

Do You own a car built by Durant? Several

Re: Headlig lens and bezels

I can't even mail the seller of the duct tape lights to find out what lense size or that those are not Durant. If a seller on eBay sells US only eBay blocks Canada from even asking a question. This started in Fall of 2017 when I was after info on some dishes that matched my late wives set. Doesn't matter if its eBay.com, eBay.ca or eBay.uk. Actually the items won't even show up on eBay.ca at all. Had to have one of our US DMACer's go after it for me.

Oh well we know the lights are not ours. As the Packard slogan goes "Ask the man who owns one" on the lights. Wonder if its the duct tape that set the high price. ha ha.

Where Are You From? Ottawa Ont

Do You own a car built by Durant? 1932 Dominion built 614 Sedan

 

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