Hi Everyone,
We have a new glassBYTEs survey today: Do you think the federal government should bail out the Big Three auto manufacturers? Please visit www.glassBYTEs.com take the survey, and, if you have thoughts on this, please post them here or e-mail me at pstacey@glass.com.
Thanks!
Penny Stacey
AGRR magazine

Make some sort of concessions for them! We let the chinese make after market parts, glass and other things for these vehicles. Why would we not want to keep them alive? There are a lot of jobs in the mix. From the detailer at the local dealership all the way to the personal chauffer driving the CEO's kids to school! Everything in this country has turned to greed, lets start at the top of the pile and do some house cleaning, starting with the lobbists in D.C.

JMHO

Sorry Penny, I went to glassbytes, and I cannot answer the question with a simple yes or no. 1 part of me says no, we have to stop this bail out mentality at the tax payers expense, and yet not just jobs, but possibly a huge negative impact on this country's economy could result from the big 3 going down. I also fear that our tax dollars could end up as bonuses in some ceos pockets like what's happening with Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac! Mr Mudd and Mr.Syron, this is a travesty, and should be tax THEFT! But sorry, for me this is not a simple yes and NO question. Yes something has to be done, but NO, we should not just hand over a few measily billions because the ceos cannot run a profitable Business!

They should not be bailed out. They made bad business decisions, some on their own and some by regulation. They should be allowed to go into bankruptcy, cancell the union contracts and lighten the regulations starting with the fuel effieciency regulations. They should also be allowed to move operations to right to work states to stop the stranglehold of the unions as well. Its no wonder they cant compete with Toyota, look at the differrences in what the Union does to them.
Who bailed out AMC,Kaiser,Oldsmobile,Plymouth,Delorean,Studebaker,Tucker, Etc?? Nobody. They were allowed to fail. The big 3 needs to be allowed to fail as well and no one, I repeat no one is too big to fail. Stop babysitting these idiots.
I love GM's plan, lets sell off Saturn and Saab and let them get a bail out. How about sell Saturn and Saab and you wont need a bailout.
Nobody will bail out my company and my company is important to my community. Its obviously not as big as the big 3, but all companies matter to their employed and their customers but all should not get a taxpayer loan to survive.
WELCOME TO THE NEW AMERICA!!!
This is where everyone gets an A+, nobody fails, we all come in first, we are all the best, nobody is special, and our forefathers would be spinning in their grave!

We should bail them out on the condition; they have to buy AMERICAN made parts to manufacture the cars. We must get our factories going again & employ Americans to get this country back on track. Stop importing foreign goods and sending our people to the unemployment lines. Stop sending our $$$ to other countries in exchange for goods & services. We MUST start manufacturing our own stuff again & sell our goods & services to other countries.

Good points, but the only one I questions is why or how would it help to lighten fuel economy restrictions? That one makes no sence to me. We need, drastically, to lessen our demand on oil, and we need to burn ALLOT less fuel, and the big oil companies and manufactures have for many many years Already have the technology in carboration, to produce much higher efficiant cars and trucks. The American public have been brainwashed and duped into thinking higher fuel economy will cost more, when in fact it will cost way less. The technology has been here for a long time. why is it that commercials this year have boasted of high fuel economy of 24-28 mpg, and we have cars from the 90's that get 32-36 mpg?????? We should be demanding much better from our manufactures and they can do so much better. If they were to roll out cars and trucks that truely got the BEST mileage that they are really capable of, they wouldn't be able to make them fast enough for the consumers,,, and that is a fact!!!!

dot... you willing to concead some emmissions standards? I am.

no bail out w/o MAJOR CONCESSIONS.

OK, emmission standards, and fuel economy are 2 different animals! If the fuel econony or mpg, where as high as humanly possible, would not the emmissions also be a wee bit different? Commom sence would say so. but yes to some of those restrictions, and absoluletly yes to no bail out without major concessions. Now one would have to take a good look at the concessions, and as was stated earlier, no bonuses, not 1 penny should go into the ceo's pockets!

funny. we're split 50-50 currently. truth is nobody knows what to do so we're gonna do it either way.

I agree with Sglas. You go dude. Things they should do. Stop sending this money overseas and having parts made and shipped. Stop building shopping malls. Stop building sub divisions. Use this land for what it was intended for. To grow and make and manufacture needs here in america. Reopen some of these factory and keep the overseas people out of the country's business. Bring the prices of things down to show us we can do it with out the overseas people. Show discrimation then. Keep the constitution out of the picture too.

I say NO to any bailouts for anyone. Let the free market fix its own problems.

What we are seeing here in my opinion is the biggest government power grab since Julius Ceasar crossed the Rubicon and took control of Rome at the point of a sword. The only difference is that we are being taken down by a pen instead of a sword.

The biggest problem I have with bailouts is WHERE DOES IT STOP?? What happens when the government technically owns 40-50% of the economy? We need to look no further then Russia to see what happens when the gov't goes into private business.

The big three need to be allowed to go into bankruptcy and straighten themselves out. This includes shedding the union contracts in my opinion.

AGN

It will be ugly but I agree with AGN. The only problem is where will our elected public servants acquire their personal wealth if they let them all fail.

L Dubbya- no kidding! I imagine most union people will blame the CEO's. Most reasonable people will blame em both. I'm just afraid the union will survive and the CEO's will return to biz as usual asap without any real change.

AGN
I agree with you on this,Where will it all end???What about if we need assistance.????Will uncle sam help us???...

I'm going contrarian today and begrudgingly saying yes to the the auto bailouts'

I don't like it but unfortunately there is too much at stake within American industry to allow these companies to go belly up.

Already due to the falloff of business, you are seeing layoffs everywhere. PPG make OE glass for Chrysler and others. What just happened yesterday with them?

Firestone, Goodyear Goodrich? How about Bendix? What about the computer chips in cars? Steel? rubber? radios? The list is endless of the parts they outsource and much of those parts are made here in the US. If GM Ford and Chrysler fold their tents. What about the hundreds of vendors that depend upon them as customers and their employees and those who supply the vendors?

What about us? What about the car dealerships we service? What about the techs that work there? The office supplies they buy? Insurance that is sold? Body shops that are vendors?

I can write names and companies that will fill pages either fail or go into extreme survival mode if any one or all of the Big Three fail.

"Stupid is and stupid does" said the world famous philosopher Forrest Gump. I can't see compounding the errors of the Big Three and tipping the dominos to cause more catastrophic economic ruin to occur and we all will rue that day if it happens.

WE helped GM, Ford and Chrysler think big because we bought big. The market demanded SUVs, 3500 PUs and vans. Detroit got Congress to give us tax breaks if we bought them. How many of you out there bought Express vans to carry your glass and tools? Thank you for helping out!!
Unions share blame. The high cost of health care raises the cost of American cars. Working for Detroit was a way to buy a house, grow a family, perhaps help put your kids through college because it helped provide a very good wage. Do you blame the workers for getting a contract??

You're mad because we aren't getting ours. I know I would like free medical, four weeks vacation, rest breaks and a legal team to defend me if I mess up at work. Those are all things that cost money and add to the cost of building cars for companies burdened with UAW contracts.
Trust me, check out government worker contracts of Federal state and local employees and compare them to the UAW. Defined benefits retirements, post employment medical coverage, vacation and sick days.

However whatever you corporate boys have now, it's because our grandfathers fought Henry Ford at The Rouge or joined John L Lewis against the coal companies. There was no such thing as 'benefits" until unions came along.

Somewhere unions got fat and many workers got complacent and our product quality fell. The Japanese and VW came in with small economomical cars and won concerts and marketshare in the 60's and never looked back

I have to end this because I could write about this to put you and myself to sleep or at least cramp your eyesight.

Nobody cares if you or I fail in our business. We are microscopic debris on the world's economy In truth, no one cared about Diamond filing BK except the Diamond guys and their vendors. If Belron crashed tomorrow, it wouldn't cause a ripple on Wall Street and or Main Street (except perhaps Columbus OH). They aren't big enough to really matter on a grand scale. (sigh!!)

The Big Three provides far more than meets the eye and I hope despite their greed, stupidity and vanity, they can survive because if they don't, this country would feel the failure far longer and deeper than many of you think.

I say screw them over paid idiots. Also to Dave who is in MI sorry guy , you should have picked a much more stable state to be open in. I feel your pain, but your placement of business is your choice. Go somewhere and open with out whiney unions.

BBI

Let's first get the facts out so that everyone here can make an informed decision.

Fact 1. Ford and GM alone have almost 1 Trillion dollars of real debt to American Banks.

Fact 2. If they are told to "go BK" they would be taking the banks down with them as well. Ford (400 Billion debt) and GM (600 Billion debt) would have already declared BK... but they can't because this would cause the banks to also fail.

Fact 3. The Automakers and banks will fail before the UAW is "broken" as this next administration/Obama will not permit this to turn into a "union-busting" event. The UAW will make concessions but they will not be broken.

Fact 4. GM has 3.5 people on pension for every 1 person in their current employ. Ford has 2.5 per 1 person working. The benefits due these people and current employees (until their deaths) if they completely went out of business tomorrow would be close to 550 billion US dollars.

Fact 5. There isn't enough money to go around if everyone expects to get "bailed out." If our government was too stupid (in the financial bailout of the banks) to simply adjust all the mortgages in the country to 3% (this approach would have saved everything; i.e. People would not default on the homes with lower interest/payments, home values would stabilize, the mortgage backed securities could have only declined 20% instead of the 60% they will because they bailed out the wrong parties, the government would eventually get their money back (deservedly so) as they guaranteed the paper for the banks anyway, etc...

Fact 6. We have had the dumbest leadership in the history of our country. At least Obama is finding qualified help to turn this around.

I do not know who J Armstead is, but he/she certainly has a pretty high opinion of himself/herself.

Is he/she on a soap box or an altar? First we had Saint Obama, now we have Saint Armstead.

I would rather they take the bailout money and distribute it to everyone who filed taxes.
Each household would have around $300-400,000.
Pay off bills-keeps busineses open
pay off mortgage-money back to the banks
pay off car loans-banks and car companies stay alive
enough left over to go shopping-money flowing in the economy again.
Granted,it's not fool-proof,but does seem like a win,win situation.

How about let them fail and lets go on with our lives...

First, the proposal is not a bailout.

So far the only thing asked for is a low interest loan that will be paid back in full with interest. Second, the UAW released a proposal this week that cuts most of their legacy benefits bring them more inline with non-union contracts. The automakers account for tens of thousands of jobs and I would think this would have more support on this forum considering we are a parallel industry to auto manufacturing.

I do think that any loan should force out the current management. The current guys have no vision.

Also, US manufacturers may need more government help than we think. Since there main competitors have no pension or healthcare costs. Those companies operate in countries where those costs are paid for by the State. Can you imagine if your main competitor did not have to may for, say, liability insurance? Their cost-per-sale would be far below yours.

What the automakers may need most is Nation Healthcare not a loan.

I think one will die and be absorbed by one of the two remaining companies. So much for Chrysler, you better sell your Dodge Rams today!

Even though the Big Three have made some serious mistakes, I do not see how they won't get bailed out. If Wall Street can get 750 Billion, then how do we not help out the auto industry? Trying not to import parts won't work as countries like China own way too much of our debt. That horse already left the barn. They will have to sit down with unions, and rework some of the contracts that are in place. Layoffs will continue, but better some than all.But to truly succeed will require better products, fuel efficient vehicles, and a competitive price.

just print more , its only paper with numbers on it.

ohm, with that thinking you will need a wheelborrow, not a billfold.

-thats my point. The money has got to come from somewhere and nobody has any , in fact most are underpaid and in hock.
So the only place it can come from is a printing press.
Are you gonna pay your share back?
How much when and how long will it take you or your great grandkids?
But some people are getting theirs up front and thats where that bailout money is gonna go where it will probably be diversified and or converted to more tangible assets before you buy your wheelbarrow.
They should have to transparently account for every dollar before receiving anything, and in this case they would still fall very short but might buy enough time for the next "creative" solution.

VOTE NO
THERE WILL ALWAYS BE DEMAND FOR VEHICLES OF ALL SIZES AND MAKES....WE THE CONSUMER WILL ALWAYS HAVE A VEHICLE, NEW OR USED.
YES, THE FAILURE WILL CAUSE A PAINFUL RIPPLE THROUGH THE ECONOMY, BUT IT TOO SHALL PASS.
WHEN THE PRICE IS RIGHT SOMEONE WILL BUY THE BIG 3'S ASSET AND SOMEONE WILL BE MAKING CARS AND TRUCKS AGAIN.
HOWEVER....HANG ON TO THE ROPE BECAUSE EITHER WAY WE ARE PROBABLY STILL IN FOR THE RIDE OF OUR LIVES.

Only if they ride bicycles to the conference...Letum go bankrupt, Im not responsible for other peoples failed business decisions.Guess mwhat..people are losing there jobs all over the place..they could probly bail out a million busineses instead.Nobody wants american cars but americans based on false pride.Similar to the "rally around the flag" phyc.,People are buying junk and taking the hit at the pump and mechanic to support our workers but you have to draw a line.Its not worth it.I will not buy a jap car..There will be american cars regardless.